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Ask the Slot Expert: Rebutting an article about why slots are not random - Part 2

22 February 2023

Question: My father had a near mint working condition Treasure Tunnel slot machine. It was stolen from his estate. How can I get a value on it?

Answer: I remember playing Treasure Tunnel machines many (many) years ago.

I would start by Googling (or Binging, if you want to chat with Microsoft's AI) for used slot dealers near you. I don't know where you're located, so I can't help you with this task. If there isn't one near you, you can try any used slot dealer. Find out what they'd pay for the machine.

Another option is to try to find one for sale. I found this auction from 2016 in which the winning bid was $615. And then there's.... Nothing more. Sigma had more success with its Derby horse race game than with its slot machines.

Any slot machine from this era that boots up and operates properly is probably worth at least $200. But given that it's Sigma and not IGT or Bally's, the thief may have done you a favor.


Last week I rebutted some of the statements I found in an article about why someone believes slot machines are not random. Those statements showed a common misconception about random events. We can know quite a bit about the big picture of a random event. The only thing we really don't know is what will happen next. If casinos couldn't depend on slot machines holding a certain percentage of the money played through them in the long run, why would they operate them? Casinos are in the gambling business, but they're not gamblers.

This week let's look at some of the author's experiences that he says show non-randomness. (I'm reminded of an article Bob Dancer wrote many years ago. He wrote that experience is a poor teacher in gambling.)

I have played certain online slot machines where the "Payout" or money won amount is displayed BEFORE the bonus game spins end.

Let's separate the online slots from the slots in casinos. I don't know what regulations govern online slots. I'll go one step further and give my usual disclaimer: I'm writing about RNG-based games (Class III in IGRA parlance).

There were a jurisdiction (I think it was Washington) in which they wanted one poll of the RNG to decide the entire outcome of a spin, even if there was a bonus round. At the time, the jurisdiction also required you to use a stored-value card to play machines. A reader wrote to me to say that he had pulled his card from the machine before his bonus round completed and the amount won in the bonus was already added to his card. This is an example of how a machine could display the result of a bonus round before it has ended and still determine the outcome randomly. The jurisdiction has since changed the regulation to allow multiple polls of the RNG for a play.

The machines you find in Nevada, New Jersey, Mississippi, etc., can't display the amount won in a bonus round before the round ends because -- it ain't over till it's over.

Anyone who's played certain slot machines, for example, could not fail to notice how you don't see ANY certain symbols on the reels for ages, then suddenly they are everywhere!

This is the streaks are not random misconception. Streaks are actually a requirement for randomness.

Here are two sequences of numbers: 1-1-1 and 2-8-5. Which sequence is random?

Most people will say that 1-1-1 is not random. Have you ever tossed a coin and gotten three heads or three tails in a row? Was that coin toss not random?

The game played could be an important factor in this observation. There are some machines that fill positions on their reels with a randomly chosen symbol for each spin. I used to play a machine (Fire Ball something or other) at the Westgate years ago. It was really exciting when the Fire Ball symbol was the randomly chosen symbol and a bunch of them appeared on the screen. That stroke of luck was extremely rare. The machine almost always chose a lower-paying symbol and the screen wasn't filled with one symbol.

If the author was playing one of these machines, it would not be unusual to suddenly see a certain symbol everywhere.

Let's continue with streaks. Say you put your music player on shuffle. If the algorithm is choosing randomly from the songs in your playlist, you could get the same song twice in a row. Most people don't want repeats. Instead of choosing the next song to play at random, the algorithm could sort the songs in the playlist into a random order, and then play from that random sorted order. No repeats.

It's important to know what is being randomized.

On some progressive jackpots linked to a bank of slot machines, the jackpot has to be won before a certain amount of money is reached. Now, if this is the case, how are they REALLY random if they have to hit before the jackpot reaches a certain amount? Completely random means they can hit at ANY time. They must be programmed to do that if they have to hit by a certain amount.

I've played some machines with must hit by progressives. (An advantage-play technique is to play these machines only when they're close to the max amount.) On these machines, the progressive is not awarded based on a combination on the reels. The progressive is randomly awarded on a spin, winner or not.

In all the slot regulations I've seen, every jurisdiction requires that the outcome determined by the numbers generated by the RNG must be displayed without alteration. There's no way to force a progressive hit on a machine when its time has come.

So how do machines award must hit by progressives randomly?

As I said about shuffle play, it's important to know what is being randomized. For these progressives, the random element is a trigger value. Each bet on each machine adds a certain amount to a running total. The player whose bet pushes the running total over the trigger amount wins the progressive.

The RNG was used when the progressive reset to pick a new trigger amount. It is not used on each spin to determine whether the player won the progressive. If that were the case, there would be no way to have the progressive hit by a certain amount. The author is right about that. The progressive could hit at any time.


Here are the latest Covid data. There is a difference in the hospitalization data for US versus NV. The CDC reports total number of Covid hospital admissions. Nevada reports current hospitalizations, not total admissions.

All data comes from the CDC (https://www.cdc.gov/covid-data-/-*tracker/#cases_totalcases, https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#new-hospital-admissions), except for Nevada current hospitalizations (https://nvhealthresponse.nv.gov/).


Totals Weekly Changes
US NV US NV
Date Cases  Hosp. Adm.  Deaths  Cases  Curr. Hosp.  Deaths  Cases  Hosp. Adm.  Deaths  Cases  Curr. Hosp.  Deaths 
 02/21/23   102,998,014   5,966,889   1,113,254   886,696   190   11,903   261,195   24,400   2,890   1,271   26   9 
 02/14/23   102,736,819   5,942,489   1,110,364   885,425   164   11,894   289,381   26,880   3,540   1,236   3   27 
 02/07/23   102,447,438   5,915,609   1,106,824   884,189   161   11,867   275,794   25,897   3,209   1,275   (87)   (8) 
 01/31/23   102,171,644   5,889,712   1,103,615   882,917   248   11,875   297,914   27,653   3,749   1,419   29   41 
 01/24/23   101,873,730   5,862,059   1,099,866   881,498   219   11,834   355,501   34,382   4,717   1,263   (73)   11 
 01/17/23   101,518,229   5,827,677   1,095,149   880,235   292   11,823   423,559   34,014   3,965   4,117   (18)   45 
 01/10/23   101,094,670   5,793,663   1,091,184   876,118   310   11,778   472,614   47,332   2,703   0   6   27 
 01/03/23   100,622,056   5,746,331   1,088,481   876,118   304   11,751   405,073   43,313   2,284   2,001   (23)   46 
 12/27/22   100,216,983   5,703,018   1,086,197   874,117   327   11,705   511,888   35,600   2,918   2,473   (18)   28 
 12/20/22   99,705,095   5,667,418   1,083,279   871,644   345   11,677   463,446   42,585   2,807   3,014   (14)   20 
 12/13/22   99,241,649   5,624,833   1,080,472   868,630   359   11,657   464,429   28,934   3,169   4,224   19   27 
 12/06/22   98,777,220   5,595,899   1,077,303   864,406   340   11,630   295,669   34,108   1,524   2,660   55   6 
 11/29/22   98,481,551   5,561,791   1,075,779   861,746   285   11,624   307,187   27,584   2,664   2,209   31   24 
 11/22/22   98,174,364   5,534,207   1,073,115   859,537   254   11,600   284,712   24,272   2,168   2,064   (2)   20 
 11/15/22   97,889,652   5,509,935   1,070,947   857,473   256   11,580   284,889   22,561   2,280   2,771   92   10 
 11/08/22   97,604,763   5,487,374   1,068,667   854,702   164   11,570   274,976   24,829   2,316   1,741   23   15 
 11/01/22   97,329,787   5,462,545   1,066,351   852,961   141   11,555   266,430   23,562   1,199   1,661   15   11 
 10/25/22   97,063,357   5,438,983   1,065,152   851,300   126   11,544   260,881   22,914   5,111   1,096   (12)   8 
 10/18/22   96,802,476   5,416,069   1,060,041   850,204   138   11,536   267,788   22,644   2,537   1,005   6   6 
 10/11/22   96,534,688   5,393,425   1,057,504   849,199   132   11,530   285,222   23,034   3,061   1,322   14   21 
 10/04/22   96,249,466   5,370,391   1,054,443   847,877   118   11,509   330,300   24,415   3,054   702   3   15 
 09/27/22   95,919,166   5,345,976   1,051,389   847,175   115   11,494   366,858   26,055   2,857   1,042   (28)   48 
 09/20/22   95,552,308   5,319,921   1,048,532   846,133   143   11,446   400,929   29,165   2,973   1,839   0   19 
 09/13/22   95,151,379   5,290,756   1,045,559   844,294   143   11,427   506,189   34,540   2,978   1,758   (40)   16 
 09/06/22   94,645,190   5,256,216   1,042,581   842,536   183   11,411   534,380   30,772   3,526   1,762   (8)   20 
 08/31/22   94,110,810   5,225,444   1,039,055   840,774   191   11,391   600,148   35,692   3,297   2,434   (44)   32 
 08/23/22   93,510,662   5,189,752   1,035,758   838,340   235   11,359   655,186   38,778   3,198   2,550   (51)   20 
 08/16/22   92,855,476   5,150,974   1,032,560   835,790   286   11,339   719,100   40,762   3,375   3,561   (92)   77 
 08/09/22   92,136,376   5,110,212   1,029,185   832,229   378   11,262   937,985   42,621   3,822   5,729   (69)   41 
 08/01/22   91,198,391   5,067,591   1,025,363   826,500   447   11,221   828,560   43,943   2,695   28,360   (5)   16 
 07/26/22   90,369,831   5,023,648   1,022,668   798,140   452   11,205   905,096   45,024   3,072   5,468   (61)   41 
 07/19/22   89,464,735   4,978,624   1,019,596   792,672   513   11,164   890,226   42,620   3,035   7,077   (20)   37 
 07/12/22   88,574,509   4,936,004   1,016,561   785,595   533   11,127   912,596   44,750   2,575   8,611   78   67 
 07/05/22   87,661,913   4,891,254   1,013,986   776,984   455   11,060   683,630   30,500   2,476   8,713   53   34 
 06/28/22   86,978,283   4,860,754   1,011,510   768,271   402   11,026   809,381   33,856   2,580   6,189   (8)   36 
 06/21/22   86,168,902   4,826,898   1,008,930   762,082   410   10,990   648,857   30,459   2,040   8,081   95   41 
 06/14/22   85,520,045   4,796,439   1,006,890   754,001   315   10,949   757,093   29,971   2,630   9,809   42   40 
 06/07/22   84,762,952   4,766,468   1,004,260   744,192   273   10,909   813,916   30,146   2,190   6,818   55   26 
 05/31/22   83,949,036   4,736,322   1,002,070   737,374   218   10,883   670,041   24,555   2,285   5,738   16   41 
 05/24/22   83,278,995   4,711,767   999,785   731,636   202   10,842   756,047   25,027   2,317   5,324   37   28 
 05/17/22   82,522,948   4,686,740   997,488   726,312   165   10,814   680,888   21,183   2,097   3,693   35   26 
 05/10/22   81,842,060   4,665,557   995,371   722,619   130   10,788   534,465   17,934   3,932   2,802   32   11 
 05/03/22   81,307,595   4,647,623   991,439   719,817   98   10,777   432,666   14,755   2,448   2,213   (6)   49 
 04/26/22   80,874,929   4,632,868   988,991   717,604   104   10,728   348,507   12,597   2,446   1,447   (22)   46 
 04/19/22   80,526,422   4,620,271   986,545   716,157   126   10,682   266,330   10,525   3,308   1,232   (37)   497 
 04/12/22   80,260,092   4,609,746   983,237   714,925   163   10,185   228,465   10,343   3,627   1,228   23   53 
 04/05/22   80,031,627   4,599,403   979,610   713,697   140   10,132   203,709   10,312   4,105   1,059   (52)   76 
 03/29/22   79,827,918   4,589,091   975,505   712,638   192   10,056   206,914   9,572   4,083   1,187   5   40 
 03/22/22   79,621,004   4,579,519   971,422   711,451   187   10,016   200,627   8,502   8,178   742   (71)   83 
 03/15/22   79,418,377   4,571,017   963,244   710,709   258   9,933   253,069   17,393   5,492   24,844   (20)   113 
 03/08/22   79,165,308   4,553,624   957,752   685,865   278   9,820   310,308   24,471   9,870   2,099   (101)   116 
 03/01/22   78,855,000   4,529,153   947,882   683,766   379   9,704   465,845   33,261   14,988   6,421   (189)   196 
 02/22/22   78,389,155   4,495,892   932,894   677,345   568   9,508   551,462   46,726   12,797   4,023   (297)   173 
 02/15/22   77,837,693   4,449,166   920,097   673,322   865   9,335   1,005,691   67,963   17,059   5,280   (375)   149 
 02/08/22   76,782,002   4,381,203   903,038   668,042   1,240   9,186   1,769,556   92,750   18,185   11,144   (387)   235 
 02/01/22   75,012,446   4,288,453   884,853   656,898   1,627   8,951   3,193,570   121,420   17,885   26,555   (344)   191 
 01/25/22   71,818,876   4,167,033   866,968   630,343   1,971   8,760   5,102,999   143,329   16,393   57,574   99   133 
 01/18/22   66,715,937   4,023,704   850,575   572,769   1,872   8,627   4,983,654   147,105   13,301   25,927   (1,787)   99 
 01/11/22   61,732,283   3,876,599   837,274   546,842   3,659   8,528   5,421,565   139,572   12,168   32,486   2,594   100 
 01/05/22   56,310,718   3,737,027   825,106   514,344   1,065   8,428   3,501,427   104,272   8,867   20,966   276   61 
 12/28/21   52,809,291   3,362,755   816,239   493,378   789   8,367   1,693,987   63,185   11,127   7,977   89   56 
 12/21   51,115,304   3,569,570   805,112   485,401   700   8,311   1,063,296   55,734   9,102   5,639   9   110 
 12/14   50,052,008   3,513,836   796,010   479,762   691   8,201   853,262   57,885   8,946   5,008   17   91 
 12/07   49,198,746   3,455,951   787,064   474,754   674   8,110   821,215   66,191   8,575   5,011   23   125 
 11/30   48,377,531   3,389,760   778,489   469,743   651   7,985   563,746   28,426   6,309   3,343   (50)   55 
 11/23   47,813,785   3,361,334   772,180   466,400   701   7,930   667,924   41,145   10,754   4,784   (24)   86 
 11/16   47,145,861   3,320,189   761,426   461,616   725   7,844   604,748   63,164   7,862   4,577   22   85 
 11/09   46,541,113   3,257,025   753,564   457,039   703   7,759   516,764   33,219   8,290   5,539   34   103 
John Robison

John Robison is an expert on slot machines and how to play them. John is a slot and video poker columnist and has written for many of gaming’s leading publications. He holds a master's degree in computer science from the prestigious Stevens Institute of Technology.

You may hear John give his slot and video poker tips live on The Good Times Show, hosted by Rudi Schiffer and Mike Schiffer, which is broadcast from Memphis on KXIQ 1180AM Friday afternoon from from 2PM to 5PM Central Time. John is on the show from 4:30 to 5. You can listen to archives of the show on the web anytime.

Books by John Robison:

The Slot Expert's Guide to Playing Slots
John Robison
John Robison is an expert on slot machines and how to play them. John is a slot and video poker columnist and has written for many of gaming’s leading publications. He holds a master's degree in computer science from the prestigious Stevens Institute of Technology.

You may hear John give his slot and video poker tips live on The Good Times Show, hosted by Rudi Schiffer and Mike Schiffer, which is broadcast from Memphis on KXIQ 1180AM Friday afternoon from from 2PM to 5PM Central Time. John is on the show from 4:30 to 5. You can listen to archives of the show on the web anytime.

Books by John Robison:

The Slot Expert's Guide to Playing Slots